your comments on a logo

[reverendflash]

I am creating a logo for a band named, <i>Down, Not Out</i> ...

Is this too cheesey, any spontaneous ideas I can steal? j/k :beam:

remember, this will be on CD's, flyers, Business Cards, etc...

http://www.aulman.com/af/dnologo1.gif

[ahmed]

well it would really help if we knew what can of company is it. I personally don't like that font, but it might just go with the company's theme :)

Besides, it's kind of too simple. I know simple is good, but this one is soo simple. Try to be more innovative ;)

hope my critism helps :beam:

[reverendflash]

ahmed:

thanks for replying...


I am creating a logo for a band named, Down, Not Out ...

Is this too cheesey, any spontaneous ideas I can steal? j/k

remember, this will be on CD's, flyers, Business Cards, etc...

it is a band... and logo's should be simple, so they are easy to reproduce, and remember... IMO...

so, given the band's name : Down, Not Out ... what would you do?

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[ahmed]

oh.. oh.. sorry.. i read that as 'creating a logo for a brand name' :beam:
I'm not sure what would I really, but i think it can be a bit more creative :)

[reverendflash]

thanks ahmed...

that is why I have posted it here... hence the "too cheesey?" question...

This logo is oversized on purpose as well. It needs to scale down and up easily, and be extremely recognizable...

Trying to figure out another way to graphically protraying <b>Down</b> ...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[ahmed]

yeah.. actually i did try scaling down and it kind of looked better..

here's just another idea to portray 'down'.. not creative but you can modifiy and probably come up with something :)

[reverendflash]

yeah, I had messed around with that kinda thang too...

I'll come up with something... I haven't shown this to the client yet...

I might try something with the initials DNO...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[ahmed]

Originally posted by reverendflash
I might try something with the initials DNO... That would be cool! I think that will give more flexibility :)

[reverendflash]

I think so, I just don't know how the client is going to like an anogram for a logo...

could be touch and go...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[liam]

i think it's much too spread out, takes up too much space, and i don't think it'd be a very good multipurpose logo (cards, cd's etc) because of that.

what i'm trying to say is that i think the logo would be hard to incorporate into the band's marketing in the future.

[reverendflash]

As I said above, this logo is oversized on purpose. The final will be scaled down drastically for use on business cards. This is the way a graphic artist designs artwork by hand, then scales down the entire image to work on whatever the client needs (used to be via photography and contact cement).

Think of this as a stencil on equipment cases... It needs to be simple, and clear... Think of "The artist formerly known as Prince", or The Grateful Dead, or any other band who's logo you would recognize 100 yds away...

if I eliminate space between the symbols, it will look too cramped when small enough for business cards...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[liam]

k rev,

no offense, but i think you can't handle constructive criticism. ahmed and i were simply trying to state our opinions about your work.

you seem to be covertly vindictive towards anyone who tries to offer any design advice to you. you're telling me how a graphic artist works? thanks.....

grateful dead? prince? both one-part logos that are easily incorporated into any design schematic.... i wouldn't compare your logo to theirs. yes, i'd recognize these two logos anywhere, but to be honest, yours is one i'd easily forget.

[.soulty]

Well its a start, and a smart concept, but i think its too graphical, two seperate images. Arrow and down and then out with the cross graphic. Try to play around with this idea make it one image.

[.soulty]

Why dont you use the o in down to make out

d
out
w
n

colour the o and out in the same colour while having d , w, n in a different colour.

[reverendflash]

Originally posted by liam
i think it's much too spread out, takes up too much space, and i don't think it'd be a very good multipurpose logo (cards, cd's etc) because of that.

what i'm trying to say is that i think the logo would be hard to incorporate into the band's marketing in the future.

Liam:

sorry if I sounded defensive. Your comment of being too spread out made little sense to me, other than the fact that the logo is purposely oversized for design reasons. The reason for telling you how graphic artists do this by hand, is because it is the way it has been done for 100 years, until the computer, and I wanted to make sure you understood why the logo is the size it is. I don't know you, or your work, so quick simple retorts usually don't sit well with me from people I don't know. If I am wrong, please let me know how many logo's you have designed, and where to see them on the web, I will appologize publically.


grateful dead? prince? both one-part logos that are easily incorporated into any design schematic.... i wouldn't compare your logo to theirs. yes, i'd recognize these two logos anywhere, but to be honest, yours is one i'd easily forget.

this last part was just rude. I did not make this personal, why did you go here?


I can take constructive criticism as long as the people who write it actually read the thread, and then give constructive criticism based on actual design experience, not just a reason to bag on someone, which happens here way too much.


Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[reverendflash]

Originally posted by Soulty
Why dont you use the o in down to make out

d
out
w
n

colour the o and out in the same colour while having d , w, n in a different colour.

thanks!

hadn't thought about doing it that way... I'll have to give it a shot. I'll let you know what I end up with...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[eyeinfinitude]

I was bored so I took your original concept and sort of combined it. I made this real quick so it's not too great, but hopefully it will give you some ideas, enjoy. =)

[reverendflash]

Thanks EG...

I will have to play with the arrangement a bit... That is kinda what I had in my head...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[liam]

rev -

i said the logo was spread out, not oversized. there's a difference there. i had read the previous posts and wasn't just stating something that had already been said.

i know how graphic artists work, today and in the past, the reason i said


you're telling me how a graphic artist works? thanks.....

and


i wouldn't compare your logo to theirs. yes, i'd recognize these two logos anywhere, but to be honest, yours is one i'd easily forget.

is because i felt like i was being insulted by you since my views didn't matter or that you feel you have more/better design experience since you don't know me or are a mod on this forum or whatever.


I don't know you, or your work, so quick simple retorts usually don't sit well with me from people I don't know.

rev, my first post wasn't a retort. i was just trying to give my opinion.


I can take constructive criticism as long as the people who write it actually read the thread, and then give constructive criticism based on actual design experience, not just a reason to bag on someone, which happens here way too much.

i read the thread. i know that you took "spread out" to mean "oversized" and i'm sorry if it sounded like that, that's not what i meant.

i'm not "bagging" on you, i felt insulted by the way you respond to criticism, on this or any of the other threads you have posted regarding a site/logo check. maybe i just don't know you, but like i said before, i see a lot of hidden retorts and get the feeling that you're being vindictive in your responses. so, i responded accordingly in my second post.

i interpret the last part of that quote to be a shot at my level of design knowledge, and it obviously is. here are a few of the logos i've designed:

the one on my homepage: http://www.vmkdsn.com

on my font viewer for clients: http://www.vmkdsn.com/thelook (click the logo to expand site)

logo for the firm design, a client of mine: http://www.vmkdsn.com/firm

logo for my dad's festival, jazz city (made logo, not site): http://www.jazzcity.ca

the one i made for paul kane high's grad site: http://www.vmkdsn.com/pkgrad

the saints: http://www.vmkdsn.com/saints (explore the site to see it in action)

i know it sounded bad, but when i said that yours is one i'd soon forget, i simply meant that it's not too eye-catching, it doesn't stick in your head. i'm sorry, that's just my opinion.

i'm not trying to start a flame war with you, i respect you as a designer, i just didn't like how you responded to my criticism, which is the whole reason you posted it on this forum.

[Alucard_X]

No need for all this.


Anyway, i have some ideas that may help you, or may not :bounce:

Firstly, down not out is the band name. It doesn't have to be their logo too ;)

What i am saying is that the words "down not out" do not have to feature at all in the logo, as words usually mess up the simplicity of design [ask me....i am creating a text heavy flash site :trout: ]

Maybe some abstract form? Maybe a sillouette of a boxer getting up after a knockdown?

The possibilites are endless :)


You are talented i am sure you will make something great. I personally do not like the logo, because the text gets in the way. But i am sure if you pull out enough hair, you will end up with something great :D

I will once again stress on not using ANY text unless it's simply DNO :)

[eudora]

hmmz pardon me.. but i feel ..a band wont need a logo??
most of it is typography work more..
a symbol to represent them as a band would be more appropriate?
:)
just my thoughts..

[.soulty]

Originally posted by Alucard_X



Maybe some abstract form? Maybe a sillouette of a boxer getting up after a knockdown?



I like this idea, would work pretty well. hard to illustrate though
:-\

[Alucard_X]

All you have to do is this:

open flash, with two layers.

Bottom layer has an image of a boxer downed [or whatever], and the layer is locked.
In the top layer, you just trace around the boxer [the outline] and fill with black....

There's the image :)

[eudora]

:)
feeling bored and tired of studying.. i did a bit of work and this is what i got..
my representation tend towards just words not much on graphics..

[Alucard_X]

I like it...but still prefer no text :P

[eudora]

opz.. haha.. think i never read carefully all the threads.. :)
sorry abt that

[enyceexgloboi]

How about this.

<img src="http://protelecom.net/public/downnotout_set.jpg">

[reverendflash]

I'm gonna be giving the client several different examples... I do not know whether they will like an anogram, or if they want a graphic, or if they want something extremely readable...

and BTW, the name of the band is <b> Down, Not Out </b> notice the comma...

liam:
i know it sounded bad, but when i said that yours is one i'd soon forget, i simply meant that it's not too eye-catching, it doesn't stick in your head. i'm sorry, that's just my opinion.

i'm not trying to start a flame war with you, i respect you as a designer, i just didn't like how you responded to my criticism, which is the whole reason you posted it on this forum.

that is why I asked if the logo was too cheesey... again, I don't respond well to short comments without backup, from people whom I have had little contact with before. It is a fault of mine, but at least I recognize it...


This is just the beginning of the process people... just flushing out ideas. I do not just sit down, end up with one graphic, and go with it. I have clients. They need to see at least 3 different diverse styles to choose from. Then, when they choose a style, then we get into creating a logo in that style. This will probably go back and forth for a couple of weeks (unless they come over and sit with me and we create one together) at least.

**end of rant**

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[jillymo]

I would like to have some time to spend on this one-
I bet you could come up with something kick***
Here is about 10 minutes working on it...

:run:

[jillymo]

oops I missed the comma :!:

[jillymo]

One more thing- geez you would think I would put this all in one reply :nerd:
What kind of music do they play and if you already addressed this and I missed it sorry....:beam:
You should have this be a contest to see who can contribute the best logo :crazy:

[reverendflash]

jillymo:

nice, very hip grunge-ish...

I guess I should say that this band is blues/folk influenced, original songs mingled with covers, with a classic rock kinda feel...

the members are all over 40, and this is thier 465th band each... these guys have played with Paul McCartney, 'Stones, Henry Butler, Molly Hatchet, Bruce Springsteen, etc (all I can remember at the moment)...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[SureShot]

wow - there are some good designs in here... good work guys.

Rev - have you started work on some other designs you could post, I would like to comment on them - it seems your other design has been commented on enough ;)

On a side note - these guys sound like a lot of fun and as if they have seen it all, I bet "meetings" with these guys is a good time!

[reverendflash]

Tuknuk:

I will post more when I have them worked out...

and yes, these guys are an absolute blast... real hard to get anything done tho...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[grimdeath]

rev i made this, might be good to look at all the ones posted and mix up everything you like about every logo ;) good luck

[reverendflash]

thanks grim...

I'll let you know what I come up with...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[dreamer]

thats a logo??? keep it small simple and catchy

[jillymo]

Maybe something more along this line then, since it is a blues/classic rock band. I would think it would depend a lot on the personalities of the actual members too, but something cool and funky comes to my mind when I think of a band like that. You know like maybe a weird looking sun type design or something along that line. The guitar thing has probably been way over used, but it does represent that type of music well.
Anyway something like this (with a little more work) might be what you are looking for.
I had better get some of my actual work done:tie:

Good Luck :nerd:

[SureShot]

Jilly, nice work :)

And Dreamer - keep your comments to yourself if your going to be and a s s about it. "That's a logo???" is being a jerk. The guy tried and came up with a result. More than I can say for you. So until you are going to say constructive things - dont type.

[jillymo]

=) Thanks SureShot, and also R. Flash for the compliment yesterday.
Also, I agree with you about Dreamer. That was just plain rude and there is no need for that!

:bad:

[dreamer]

didn't mean it that way. sorry...

[reverendflash]

Otay Guys...

you wanted to see more ideas...

http://aulman.com/af/dnologo2.gif

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[.soulty]

i like 3 , but the font dosent do it justice.

:: you need the commar as well. :-\

[reverendflash]

thanks soulty... I still have some work to do on the fonts on all of these...

I left the comma out of one, just to see their response...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[.soulty]

i must admit its a hard name to work with, good luck. and yeah if you can permission to not use that commar it will help you big time. best of luck :smirk:

[reverendflash]

it will be in their court soon...

I haven't decided on when I will show to them... or if I want to show it to them via print in person...

gotta think on this for a while...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[.soulty]

its best to show them in person, reason being is that you can discuss why you did this and that, and explain maybe we can drop this and add this. so its best to meet up with them, because you might buy yourself some legroom with your "designers professional opinion". ;)

[reverendflash]

yes, and no...

There are benefits to both in person, and by showing it to just one member via the web, especially if the item is a web-based item, and also how difficult it is to meet with them...

I don't really want to explain anything, since their gut reaction is what I need to hear, if you know what I mean... I won't explain anything if I meet in person either... A lot of times it is the only way to not influence the decision (and won't come back to bite you in the butt as well)...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[abzoid]

Otay, everyone stand back, remove any small children and pets from the room, this code head is gonna toss out an idea. :P

This is just a concept, still needs to be spruced up with a little color, perhaps a different font, rounded lines instead of boxes, etc.

Maybe even spell other words with the extra letters.

[.soulty]

how'd the logo meeting go, rev?

[reverendflash]

it hasn't yet...

have patience young Jedi...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif

[jillymo]

I vote for number 2. If you can get them to go with the initials only like that, I really love that one.
Especially with the description you gave of the band, I think that one captures that style of music.
I guess also I am not so big on the arrow idea. Anyway, nice work RF!
:cool: :goatee: =)

[reverendflash]

jilly:

thanks.. I'm not really fond of the arrows myself...

We will see... The band is out of town for a week or so, so I might redo some of them before I show them to the band...

Revhttp://www.aulman.com/rev.gif