Robot in progress (3D max)

[ironikart]

I've been fiddling around with brazil lately and this is what I've got so far. Eventually it will be a four legged, armoured, mecha-bot type thing... but I've only got as far as the leg.

Brazil kicks arse over max's scanline renderer. I don't know why I haven't used it before!... oh yeah, my computer is crap and renders take forever!

[eilsoe]

niiiice =)

[prstudio]

wow good work

[nobody]

looks really good ironkart :A+:

[Alex]

wow that really does look good. It looks so real to!. Keep up the good work.

[andr.in]

wha that's cool! Like the ones the proffessional-made ones! Can't wait so to see the whole robot!

[Alex]

i wonder if you could make that animated, that would be really cool. :)

[eyeinfinitude]

So far so good, finish the rest of it and slap on some textures and post it back up. Get to work!! :P

[mdipi]

how much was brazi;? i only hear good things. looksgreatr!

[ironikart]

this version of brazil is free (public test version). I think it goes for 60 days then expires... but I'm not sure on that. The site is splutterfish (http://www.splutterfish.com). I think they've temporarily stopped giving out the test version at the moment though.

I could animate this, but my skills with animation are fairly limited and the final animation would take several hours to render for a few seconds animation... I wish I had that kind of time or a faster PC to render it on!

[ironikart]

Here is an updated version on the work I've done so far. It's coming together slowly, but I'm having a hard time with a few jagged edges on the legs themselves. They are geometrically smooth, but brazil makes a jagged line. Perhaps it'll clear up when I adjust the sampling a bit higher and put lights in the scene?

Let me know what you all think so far.

[splintcll]

Wow man, that's lookin really nice. Wish I had the skills like you in 3dsMax. Got it around 2 months ago, still trying to learn how to make a box.

splintcll :smirk:

[freaqazoid]

nice there ironikart.. real nice!

[ironikart]

* bump *

Going to add a new render as soon as it finishes....
waiting... waiting... waiting...

[DDD]

brazil rocks just got it......cant wait to see your render

[ironikart]

Ok, 3 hours later I have another render. I've blocked in the body and I'm going to start working on the details and the ****pit. I'm tossing up whether or not to get rid of the tank turret. I think it would look better with an artillery-like cannon mounted at an angle.

{I'm already gritting my teeth at the prospect of the final render... its looking like a full day or so of rendering at this rate)

[fishtank]

keeeewl!!!

[mlk]

heh incredible - (uuuunconceivable), i like the Kirupafilters, c0ckpit.....

[andr.in]

that's not exactly what I expected but it KICKS AZZ
COol! I can already imagine it walking.. boom... boom... ::camera shaking:: :)

[Starpromo]

yeah very nice... have you tried to put on that render that was used by someone not long about that gave a realistic shine to it.

i think that would look great.

[DDD]

is that HDR?? It looks very very cool!!!!!

Oh I read the post more clearly....I guess you plan to hdr....and yes that will take a while.....long live network rendering.

[Starpromo]

yeah thats what i was taking about but the name slipped my mind...

it would look awsome

[ironikart]

Originally posted by 3d-iva
is that HDR?? It looks very very cool!!!!!

Oh I read the post more clearly....I guess you plan to hdr....and yes that will take a while.....long live network rendering.

yeah, no HDR yet... Still coming to grips with it. I have yet to find a decent tut on using HDR plugins. If you guys know of any, please let me know!

[DDD]

are you going to use mental ray or brazil....or what.....Over the past few days I have been playing with brazil....it is pretty straight forward and the sight offers some tuts I beleive www.splutterfish.com

[Ryall]

I'm just gonna jump in here and say that I think that is really awesome!! The detail on the guns and legs are great... but I think you should add some more detail to the main body (and you are definitly capable)... also have you though about using a different texture map? maybe something more like brushed aluminum (just a thought - what you have now is awesome, but I like throwing ideas out there)?

Peace

[ironikart]

hehe, yeah there will be alot more detail and it is untextured at the moment so it will look a little plain.

Read the HDR tut on splutterfish and it seems fairly straight forward. I'll leave testing out renders until the model is ready. I'm going to re-design the shape of the body... I lacked the inspiration to finish the first one.

I'm also thinking about trying out the newer version of brazil 0.4.53 public test (I think that is the version number).:beam:

[DDD]

they are up to v1....and it is awesome

[Iammontoya]

searching for Brazil out there... cant find it. Will continue my search

[ironikart]

Here is the link to 0.4.53:
http://www.splutterfish.com/download/Brazil_test_0_4_53.zip

Its a public test so it's free. (2.26mb download)

I've started another render of my updated model... getting close to the tedious task of texturing!

[Ryall]

I cant wait to see your results :)

Peace

[ironikart]

Ok, my last render before final modelling touch ups and texturing tommorow. I'm going to be doing most of the textures in photoshop to give it an original flavour. I think it'll take a while to finish the textures so it might be a few days before I get to render a final image.

This render has the updated body... still missing a few details.

My intention for the finished work: This will be a backdrop to a character model (haven't started yet, but I picked up a second hand copy of character studio 2.2 for peanuts so I'm anxious to give it a go).

** apologies for the slight blur on the image. I undersampled and cut down on the anti aliasing samples for a faster render. It took about 1 1/2 hours for this one.

[iLikePie]

that looks sooo cool :alien: i like how it looks kinda like a realistic robot thing rather than all the stylised mecha we see so often (which is also cool)

sorry to ask this question again (i've asked before) but exactly what advantages do some renderers offer over others. I'm still confused, because i thought a render just shows what you've already modelled therefore can't really improve on it?

Thanks, and good job ironikart!
Stuart

[DDD]

In the case of brazil...(and most renders) it uses Floation Point math when dealing with the colors so technically you have an infinite amount of colors....which equals greater detail......And most native renders suck in comparison...,outside of that there is not much diff.....but that is a biggie

[DDD]

I liked the turret....the way you had it b4.....The machine looks kinda cumbersome now......dont know call me nit-picky but if this were an actual machine its mobility would be 0.0......with the turret you could shoot people from the side and stuff.......eh....I have been up all night....so im kinda tweakin....it still looks cool man....

[.soulty]

you looking for some hdr tutorials? using what renderer and what app?

::: Oh btw , nice modelling on the robot, I agree with 3d-iva which the turrent. dosent look like the machine would be able to shot to the left and right, without it moving its body, unless you are going for that , either way , very nice :)

[.soulty]

Originally posted by iLikePie
what advantages do some renderers offer over others. I'm still confused, because i thought a render just shows what you've already modelled therefore can't really improve on it?



Major advantages!! native renderes (unless they are Mental ray 3.2 native like XSI and the newer version of maya and cinema) are not bad but no way as good as the other renders like Mental ray and Renderman, Brazil for max. These renders give out options to make realistic renders , such things as caustics and final gathering. If used wisely the native renderer of any app can bring out some great results though most plugin renders are faster, easier, more advanced and just render out better.

A render is basically the visual presentation of all things related to your scene, lights (visablilty.lighting, shadows, reflection, refractions) Model (sharp, soft, smooth.ect..) Effects (particles)
and so on, also options that are turned on and off in your render options. Everything in your scene is run through the maths equations of the renderer calculating what your scene will look like.

Just look at a normal render of a ball, then render it out with a HDRI surface shader using final gathering and then you will see the difference.

:smirk:

[Voodoo~Chile]

Just a question... Those fans on the legs... Are they jet-engine fans?? Because if so... the legs' upper joints and bolts are occupying the space where the jet-engine should be.
If the fans are simply cooling fans, then why do you need to cool the area behind it... when it's hydrolics.

These are just observations... but the graphics are sweet!!!!!!

[DDD]

Dude!!! now that is observant.......ill answer for him "because"....j/k...I thought I was being to observant with the turret thing.....you made me feel better voodoo..

I think those fans are cooling the flux capacitor........:trout:

[.soulty]

lol, Now thats a sign of a perfectionist. good observation. :smirk:

[ironikart]

Originally posted by Voodoo~Chile
Just a question... Those fans on the legs... Are they jet-engine fans?? Because if so... the legs' upper joints and bolts are occupying the space where the jet-engine should be.
If the fans are simply cooling fans, then why do you need to cool the area behind it... when it's hydrolics.

These are just observations... but the graphics are sweet!!!!!!

Very observant! I'll make the appropriate changes today. May as well tweak the model before I start texturing...

BTW- I'm using 3D max and Brazil 0.2.26 (haven't installed 4.53 yet... but I'll get around to it eventually).

I modelled the cannon with the old WW2 "Bertha" artillery cannons in mind. I could make 2 models, 1 for artillery and 1 with the tank turret, but I'll persevere with this one for now.


sorry to ask this question again (i've asked before) but exactly what advantages do some renderers offer over others. I'm still confused, because i thought a render just shows what you've already modelled therefore can't really improve on it?

Apart from what has been said already... Max r3 doesn't support Global Illumination (GI). It needs the aid of a renderer to trace the path of light and have it reflected back on other surfaces (using ray tracing). In the real world light bounces of objects and hits other objects. GI simulates this and gives a more realistic render (The effect is called radiosity).

Max r5 has these features inbuilt into the default renderer, but I am under the impression that it still can't compete with 3rd party plugins.

[mdipi]

hey man one question, how did you get the holes in the legs? i got r5 just a little while ago but i dont know hwo you split it up like that...

[.soulty]

Found some HDR-i tuts for Max users

http://www.finalrender.com/finalrender/the_product8.htm

Click on HDR shop link
http://www.trinity3d.com/links/links-plugs-max.shtml

this one uses Brazil renderer
http://www.splutterfish.com/gabry_hdri_tut_tmp/

some dude answering a question on how to get HDR images in max (he mentions different renderers)
http://pub86.ezboard.com/fhdrshopfrm1.showMessage?topicID=45.topic

http://www.rendermania.com/HDRI/

The best one is the one i mentioned that uses The brazil renderer , but check them all out ;)

[ironikart]

Thanks for those links... I'll definately check them out!


hey man one question, how did you get the holes in the legs? i got r5 just a little while ago but i dont know hwo you split it up like that...

I used Booleans to subtract cylinder primitives from the main shape.:hat:

[DDD]

boolean modelling I think dippy......oooops someone already said that......

[ironikart]

Ok, here is a partly textured render. It's starting to give me a headache so I'm going to give this model a rest and start working on my characters (I'll post my renders in this forum if you guys want to see them).

I didn't fix the fans that much, just a bit of cowling around the blades (it's a new fan model, just for a bit of variety between the smaller fans).

Let me know what you think.:stunned:

[.soulty]

Nice dude, now render it using HDR! :P

[ironikart]

I've skimmed through the tuts and it seems I need to download the HDR studio(?) program in order to make the HDR maps before using them in max... I thought HDR maps could me made using the plugin?

[.soulty]

in order to use the hdr probes you have to convert them to something max can detect. read the brazil one throughout, its a good tut.


I thought HDR maps could me made using the plugin?
:::you might need Mental ray of final gathering plugin to do that, but since you have Brazil , look at the tutorial.

[mdipi]

wow man that looks good. Boolean modeling? *mike waits 3 yrs* l;ol

[ironikart]

Booleans aren't too hard to learn. Try using compound objects in max and you can add, subtract, instersect and join separate objects to form a new one. I started using them in Bryce about 5 years ago and max's booleans were a natural transition.

[DDD]

think of booleans as adding to or subtracting from a path in photshop to create a new shape with more or less faces....It is the same idea

[vts31]

get HDR studio then use brazil to render the HDRI images.

[ironikart]

My mistake - the download is called HDR shop. It's only 870 kb, but when I tried to download it, it froze on 60kb and would go any further. Most probably my firewall doesn't like downloading an .exe file so I'll have a go at home.

[mdipi]

hmmm. are there any tuts on how to use booleans?

[chris9902]

am i the only one who is reading this and thinking "WHAT THE **** IS GOING ON":-\

i got 3D studio max 5 weeks ago and can't do anything with it. i tried Gmax before i got it, i did the tutorials in about a night but that was hard at first because they would say "use this tool" and your like "were the **** is that".

anyway i am going to spend the next yew "years" learning photoshop and 3D studio 5... my new toys:nerd:


...RIP credit card:*(

[mdipi]

lol. 3ds max is the biggest challenge ever on the computer for me...

[ironikart]

Ok...I got HDR maps working in Max now. I'm doing a new render now at a higher resolution and light reflection on the floor to test the render with HDR maps. It's still going to be toned down, but I can already tell by the lighting that it'll have a bit more realism to it... not much of a change though because there aren't too many reflective surfaces to show of the HDR. It'll be done in a few hours I expect. I'll post it here when it's finished;)

[ironikart]

Originally posted by chris9902
am i the only one who is reading this and thinking "WHAT THE **** IS GOING ON":-\

i got 3D studio max 5 weeks ago and can't do anything with it. i tried Gmax before i got it, i did the tutorials in about a night but that was hard at first because they would say "use this tool" and your like "were the **** is that".

anyway i am going to spend the next yew "years" learning photoshop and 3D studio 5... my new toys:nerd:


...RIP credit card:*(

Learn the theory and it can pretty much be applied to any 3d program and you'll understand how to get some good pics... That being said I'm still learning after 5 years of on again, off again work with max.

Good tuts can be found. Check out:
www.3dbuzz.com
www.3dstudio.com
www.3dcafe.com
(do those tuts and it will give you some pretty good beginner experience with Max)

[.soulty]

Sweeetttt , some tweaking maybe to the hdr render settings and it should look killa !!!!! :beam:

[.soulty]

Chris ironikart is right, you need to learn the basics and basically each 3d app has the same practical modeling , lighting and rendering theories behind them. I have also been learning 3d for a good 4 -5 years now, and still think i'm crap. My theory is that you have to produce some crap before you can produce anything that looks good. It's all a learning process.

And for max users , there is some awesome free tut vidoes at

www.3d-palace.com

::soulty::smirk::::

[ironikart]

My theory is that you have to produce some crap before you can produce anything that looks good.

How True! you should see my first renders! All candlesticks and glasses... I tried to model a bathroom as one of first models and it looked pretty crap, well compared to my current skill level.

[.soulty]

yeah my first stuff was all relating to revolving things, cups, glasses, u name it, i revolved it. lol :)

[ironikart]

Here is the final render. I picked up on quite a few texture mapping mistakes, but after 3 1/2 hours I'm beat... I'll do a better render in a week or so.

HDR made a difference, but it was very subtle because of the lack of reflective surfaces... well I assume that is why:-\

Tell me what you think (I hope it attaches ok)

[andr.in]

hot ****! That's kewl! Is that 3ds max 4 or 5?
Man that awesome!

[.soulty]

At first you think its only a few improvement, but then look at your old render!!! The HDR one looks great, the colour looks better the shading is better and the shadows are softer and more subtle. :beam:

Also remember , there are different HDR probes you can try, which give out different results , i'm guessing you used the beach one for this render?

[chris9902]

that is so cool=)

you should make loads of different things to match that style

[ironikart]

Originally posted by Soulty
At first you think its only a few improvement, but then look at your old render!!! The HDR one looks great, the colour looks better the shading is better and the shadows are softer and more subtle. :beam:

Also remember , there are different HDR probes you can try, which give out different results , i'm guessing you used the beach one for this render?

Yeah, you can't really see the results unless you compare it to the other renders... its subtle, but adds that bit more realism to the image. I used the building probe as a lat/long spherical mapped environment (and Brazil sky light map). I didn't bump up the RGB values on the HDR map too much (about 50.2). The light area reflected beneath on the floor is the sky of the map being reflected back. I think if I changed the angle more dramatically you'd be able to see the buildings reflected back as well, but I wanted to leave anything else out as the focus is on the model.

I screwed up the texturing on the legs... it's only really obvious if you look close, but I should have checked 2 sided. I guess it's one downside to using max 3... it doesn't handle booleans quite so well as the newer version, it tends to screw up the geometry a bit.

Cheers for your comments people, and thanks Soulty, you've been a great help!

[DDD]

Man that is f'n sweet.....HDR is the greatest......I could not spot the texture mishap on the legs......Great work man...

[c!rYx]

Wow dude, this is awesome, it is better than some game characters I've seen. You should make the next Mech Warriors :) Yeah

[.soulty]

Originally posted by ironikart
Cheers for your comments people, and thanks Soulty, you've been a great help!
Anytime mate, glad to help where I can :beam:

[Jubba]

WHAT?! thats awesome!

[c!rYx]

haha, Jubba's Signature is AWESOME!!!

[Iammontoya]

that is sweet. Im afraid all I have for 3d is Plasma at this time. Hmm.. will have to look into Brazil and 3ds (oh man.. sounds expensive!).

[ironikart]

Originally posted by Iammontoya
that is sweet. Im afraid all I have for 3d is Plasma at this time. Hmm.. will have to look into Brazil and 3ds (oh man.. sounds expensive!).

Do what I did and chase down a second hand copy... it's alot cheaper and you can still make decent models with older versions.

[DDD]

hey ironikart sent you a pm

[DDD]

hey nevermind ironikart I figured what I was doing wrong with mine....I forgot to to change the path on the .exe to reflect where brazil is
......

[Jubba]

Can you give us some other views? :)

Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please

[ironikart]

wow... who says begging never gets you anywhere ;) . Sure, I'll render up a few more views when I can get some time, unfortunately I've run out today... I'll see if I can post some more on monday. Perhaps I'll put it in a scene... I was thinking an urban type scene with a few soldiers (of course, then I'd have to model the soldiers as well! ah well, its all worth it. The good thing about 3D is that you can use the models again and again).

[Black_Lightning]

ironikart, you got some real talent there... very nice renders.

it doesn't mean much coming from me as i only got till the tutorial where you make a 3d jet fighter in 3dmax lol :)

[ironikart]

As promised I rendered a slightly different view over the weekend. I couldn't really show the back as I skimped on the detail (why model what you won't see).

I changed the colour as well for a bit of variety.

[raichu]

very nice! i like teh first version of the art thogh the secong one makes it look not as futurisk

[.soulty]

Originally posted by ironikart
I couldn't really show the back as I skimped on the detail (why model what you won't see).

lol, well it kinda stops you from animating it, :smirk:

nice render , emphasis the detail you put into the side. I really want to create something in 3d now, well actually finished one of my 10 unfinished models, lol

Well like i said before , great work and maybe on another job the hdr render will be more effective. :beam:

[mdipi]

:bump: